Reggae in colleges.

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It's pointless continuing this conversation any further. It's clear that @dexBG has his own opinion on the subject which isn't exactly popular. I do not agree with his views but I can understand it. It will be better if we leave it at that since continuing with it will lead us to nowhere.
 
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Yes. Why should I put a 'senior' on a pedestal? Tell me, if we were living in the same neighborhood (and I didn't know you), and I came up to you and asked you all these questions and then asked you to sing/dance/act, would you have done it? Or would you have treated me 'mundanely' too?

Simply this - To compare a neighborhood to college campus is quite unfair .. using such an example is quite pointless.

No one is asking for a pedestal .. if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)

As i mentioned before i've seen the effect that removing ragging from campus has .. usually its the junior batches who are most enthusiastic about participating in college activities ans festivals.
by the time I graduated .. the newest batch lived in a world of their own .. the few who volunteered were gladly welcomed and mentored.

But I guess many here feel that you can get through college on your own and leave out the mentoring and experience you can gain from seniors.

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It's pointless continuing this conversation any further. It's clear that dexBG has his own opinion on the subject which isn't exactly popular. I do not agree with his views but I can understand it. It will be better if we leave it at that since continuing with it will lead us to nowhere.

I'm surprised that I'm alone on this side of the discussion .. guess things have changed a lot more that I expected.

To summarize - by ragging I don't condone the torture and physical abuse that inflicted on young guys who are just entering adulthood. Its stupid and deplorable.

But a certain amount of discipline and obedience is expected in an Academic/Social environment of college .. in the start however things are made tough so that people adapt more quickly to that.
 
I'm surprised that I'm alone on this side of the discussion .. guess things have changed a lot more that I expected.


Well, I'm older than you by two years and I never indulged nor found myself at the wrong end of ragging. Not even mild ragging. Seems like I turned out pretty okay without the whole charade.

No one is asking for a pedestal .. if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)

Respecting an unknown person only because he/she is a year or two older than you? Whatever happened to 'respect is earned, not given'? That is being put on an almighty pedestal in my books. It is not wrong to have an ego. It's wrong when this ego messes with someone else's. Seniors don't like their egos being demolished? Don't indulge in the first place. Keeps egos of both sides intact and everything is good. Again, you will not agree with what I said and we'll keep travelling in circles.
 
Fortunately our college had really strict rules regarding ragging during first year. There were seniors who were made to drop a a semester for breaking the rules. There were also enough events that juniors and seniors had a chance to interact as normal people do and by the time we hit second year, there was no "reason" for intros. I hated the couple of intros I had to give because I am a very private person. The lack of widespread intros in the hostel didn't stop me from having more friends from the senior batches than my own batch.

care to explain precisely why ?

Because you seem to have an idea in your head about how social life in college/hostel should be structured and are keen to impose that idea on others. You believe it is your duty to help mould your juniors and "prepare" then for life after college.

Some of us believe otherwise. College should be a place you meet new people, interact and learn and that can happen over four years at ones own pace. You get to choose your friends which can be your batch mates, seniors, juniors, people you meet outside college, anyone. There is not reason to dictate that everyone is one big family. You are not your junior's keeper.
 
if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)
What do you mean by this ? You will get respect, when you give respect. Ragging is not at all giving respect my friend !
 
Not everyone who rags is a scumbag .. and Hazing is no way related to Stockholm's .. as humorous as that may sound.

And want to stay on topic ?

Yes, they are scumbags, and Hazing is related to Stockholm in terms of bonding, it's not humorous, and I was on topic.
 
Fortunately our college had really strict rules regarding ragging during first year. There were seniors who were made to drop a a semester for breaking the rules. There were also enough events that juniors and seniors had a chance to interact as normal people do and by the time we hit second year, there was no "reason" for intros. I hated the couple of intros I had to give because I am a very private person. The lack of widespread intros in the hostel didn't stop me from having more friends from the senior batches than my own batch.



Because you seem to have an idea in your head about how social life in college/hostel should be structured and are keen to impose that idea on others. You believe it is your duty to help mould your juniors and "prepare" then for life after college.

Some of us believe otherwise. College should be a place you meet new people, interact and learn and that can happen over four years at ones own pace. You get to choose your friends which can be your batch mates, seniors, juniors, people you meet outside college, anyone. There is not reason to dictate that everyone is one big family. You are not your junior's keeper.

Okay .. I'll try to clarify .. its not a seniors job to mould or improve a Juniors personality .. I do not believe that .. but it certainly helps if it turns out like that.
Ragging does not go on for the 4 years .. you have ample time to pick and choose your friends and seniors you want to befriend .. don't intentionally misinterpret what i've said.

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What do you mean by this ? You will get respect, when you give respect. Ragging is not at all giving respect my friend !

That's never the case .. those who are respectful usually get by alright.

Is answering a Seniors question respect ?

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Yes, they are scumbags, and Hazing is related to Stockholm in terms of bonding, it's not humorous, and I was on topic.

Okay.. I wasn't aware of the link between Stockholm to Hazing .. though I have tried to check but haven't come up with anything conclusive.

and the use of Stockholm with respect to ragging is incorrect .. and your suggestion that it applies to me is even more wildly conjured.
 
Okay .. I'll try to clarify .. its not a seniors job to mould or improve a Juniors personality .. I do not believe that .. but it certainly helps if it turns out like that.
Ragging does not go on for the 4 years .. you have ample time to pick and choose your friends and seniors you want to befriend .. don't intentionally misinterpret what i've said.

I don't believe I have misinterpreted your ideas.

You said because of lack of ragging the junior batch lived in their own world (post #82 ) - If you intention was not to force them to be friendly with you, why would you care?

You have said that a person has been ragged is more submissive and that helps in work environments (post #69 ) - "If a person can't handle any discomfort in a controlled environment as college then god forbid what will happen to him as a grown man everyday." (Post #14). " its not a seniors job to mould or improve a Juniors personality .. I do not believe that .." (post #89) - Again, if your aim was not to help your juniors learn about life, what was it about?

"That's never the case .. those who are respectful usually get by alright." (post #89) "No one is asking for a pedestal .. if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)" (post #82 ) - To be frank, this does indicate that it is about the senior's ego and issues with juniors acting "cocky" (what ever the definition of that is). Is wearing jeans and t-shirt cocky? Is driving to college on the first day cocky?
 
I don't believe I have misinterpreted your ideas.

You said because of lack of ragging the junior batch lived in their own world (post [URL=http://www.techenclave.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=82]#82 [/URL] ) - If you intention was not to force them to be friendly with you, why would you care?

You have said that a person has been ragged is more submissive and that helps in work environments (post #69 ) - "If a person can't handle any discomfort in a controlled environment as college then god forbid what will happen to him as a grown man everyday." (Post #14). " its not a seniors job to mould or improve a Juniors personality .. I do not believe that .." (post #89) - Again, if your aim was not to help your juniors learn about life, what was it about?

"That's never the case .. those who are respectful usually get by alright." (post #89) "No one is asking for a pedestal .. if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)" (post [URL=http://www.techenclave.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=82]#82 [/URL] ) - To be frank, this does indicate that it is about the senior's ego and issues with juniors acting "cocky" (what ever the definition of that is). Is wearing jeans and t-shirt cocky? Is driving to college on the first day cocky?

for post #82 - Juniors chose to remain secluded .. I believe I was referring to the natural bonding that someone pointed that happens between humans all the time. So don't twist that further..

You are making your own simplistic interpretations .. since you have already quoted where I've clarified this further I don't see what doubt still remains.
You choose to portray it as seniors must rag juniors to make them tough .. and since even giving an intro is considered ragging here which should be abolished as well . the sentiment can not be communicated in any other way.

the jeans n clothing is your example .. and I was aware some one would want to jump on my comment so I have already clarified it there itself ..
"high on their own egos" is an over-statement .. so climb off of it.
 
Reading how some people defend their seniors, I too was thinking about this Stockholm Syndrome.

Anyway, from what I have read, a few days of ragging or hazing or whatever one may want to call it doesn't change ones personality. No matter how hard we try, our brain is not structured in that manner. As far as my knowledge goes, it probably takes months and years for an introvert to become an extrovert, if it is even possible at all. Do note that I am not using the term "introvert" in the conventional negative manner, but just as a personality trait.

I will tell you my experience. I was the first batch in my college, so never experienced any ragging. Job in my first company also went fine. Three years later, I joined a new company. There were 3 juniors (seniors were all well behaved), and seeing how soft spoken and timid I am, they used to make fun of me all the time. There was one lady who was senior to me, and she would defend me at times when this happens in front of her. I tolerated their behavior, never said anything back no matter how bad I felt, and usually just smiled at them. I also was thinking maybe I will get better, that I will get stronger one day to the point that these kind of behavior won't matter to me, or that I will one day get the strength to fight back. I waited for almost 1.5 years. Nothing happened! It came to a point that on some days I didn't even want to go to office because of that. The final result-I literally stopped talking to anybody in my team. If I were known as the silent guy earlier, now I have become the "that guy who sits in the corner, does the job, whether he comes or goes nobody cares" guy. I don't know how to act tough so that such people will leave me alone, so the only choice I have is to avoid everyone at all cost, observe for a very very long time who behaves in what manner, and then become friendly to those whom I am sure won't make me feel bad. Mind you, this is not because of my ego, but because of my desire to have a peaceful life, just so that I can focus on my work and move on.

When I got an onsite opportunity, one of the plus points I considered was that I can be away from these guys. Strangely, one of them already came to the same location I am working, and another one will be coming soon. Even though I had already decided never to have any interaction with that guy, I ended up letting him stay with me for 2 months until he got a car and was able to live independently. Being the “nice guy” I am, I never said anything even sarcastically to him in these two months.

What made things worse for me was that when I came to onsite, I had to stay with a guy who introduced me to his group of friends. He had only good intentions- probably after seeing me the way I am; he thought he could change me. His friends used to force me into drinking (which I absolutely hate, I don’t even drink any of those carbonated drinks usually), used to make fun of me, call me bad words when they get drunk, eat all the food I cook, wake me up in the middle of the night to make them food, make the house a mess etc. I was never used to any of these, and I was thinking what I experienced in office back in India was much milder than this. I actually wanted to go back to India, but knowing that these kinds of opportunities are hard to come by, I stayed. The moment I got a chance, I took my own apartment and moved out. If the experience in office made me not to socialize in office, this has made me afraid of even making new friends.

Initially, I used to think that may be these people don’t know how their behavior is making me feel. Just last week, I met my old roommate’s friends during lunch (we all work at the same customer location). I had actually changed my lunch timings just so that I won’t run into them. They were talking about gun control in US. In between, one of them jokingly said that considering the way he behaved with me, if I get hold of a gun, he would be the first target. I really don’t know why some people behave that way despite knowing well what they are doing.

Why did I say all these? Just so that people who defend such behavior should understand that not everybody has the capability of dealing with all things, which would appear so simple or harmless to them. It’s nobody’s business to mess around in another person’s life. If you think you can help, you are welcome. But even when you are offering help to someone, you have to be careful. That person may interpret that as “you considering him as a weak person”. I know some will think that I couldn’t deal with any of these because I was never ragged, but I would have probably dropped out of college if I were in the same state of mind back then as I am now.
 
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Thanks for sharing that #unni ..

Ragging is not personality cure and you're right being introverted is not a weakness .. I believe its how people choose to deal with situations ..
People who are considered extroverts jump head first into situation without the fear of coming out like an idiot .. an introvert wont do anything so spontaneous they react in a measured way.

But being reclusive is not good too .. you can always find company that you will enjoy and is at your pace. don't get discouraged by a few odd people.
 
Simply this - To compare a neighborhood to college campus is quite unfair .. using such an example is quite pointless.

No one is asking for a pedestal .. if every junior who walks into the college knows to be respectful to seniors then this whole situation can be avoided ... 95% of them don't and stroll in high on their own egos. (to put it bluntly)

As i mentioned before i've seen the effect that removing ragging from campus has .. usually its the junior batches who are most enthusiastic about participating in college activities ans festivals.
by the time I graduated .. the newest batch lived in a world of their own .. the few who volunteered were gladly welcomed and mentored.

But I guess many here feel that you can get through college on your own and leave out the mentoring and experience you can gain from seniors.

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I'm surprised that I'm alone on this side of the discussion .. guess things have changed a lot more that I expected.

To summarize - by ragging I don't condone the torture and physical abuse that inflicted on young guys who are just entering adulthood. Its stupid and deplorable.

But a certain amount of discipline and obedience is expected in an Academic/Social environment of college .. in the start however things are made tough so that people adapt more quickly to that.


Though I dislike the use of profanities anywhere, what you say above is bullshit. I was in one of those top 10 kind of MBA colleges, where you had to do all these funny stuff just because you were a junior. The most enthusiastic would be the freshers who had no work experience. I did not learn even a word from them and I do not care. The only reason I am ofended is because someone is trying to justify ragging. I do not want to talk to any senior, I do not want to interact and I do not want to be a part of some damn music festival. This is my life and so let it be.

It is only in India that you are forced to do such idiotic stuff and this should be absolutely and immediately stopped. It does not matter if there are a 100 college's within my college. Far far better than ragging.
 
What I say is BS because you disagree with me seem to have to chosen a varied lifestyle .. kinda anti-climactic there gotta say.
 
What I say is BS because you disagree with me seem to have to chosen a varied lifestyle .. kinda anti-climactic there gotta say.

Most of what you have said is actually BS, @dexBG. Sorry to say. People should be able to have free-will and no, colleges are not some training ground for personality. Your justification is gross and anti-personal, but more oriented towards groupism and herd instinct. That is what I meant by, when I was getting pissed off. I was ragged in a college also from UP, probably worse than yours for like 40-50 straight days. At night we had to wear special clothes for ragging. No one, absolutely no one should have to go through that. We were literally made animals, and herded around. Did it teach me anything..I doubt it. All your points which you say are the merits of ragging, can be kicked to dust within a minute. Is @raj_pol , choosing a varied lifestyle, cause he does not want to participate in music festivals or want to tell other about himself. Please, I hate to interact with people, and hate to answer questions out-of-line. This is something Indians love to do. And that is pissing off. Ragging is forced subjugation, and even in 1% are not comfortable it should be stopped. Colleges are not meant for this. It is for education.
 
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